Trouble At The Border

In regard to relations with Croatia, we should ask ourselves in the light of eavesdropping – since this is some kind of a precedent – that such information was published in the media and that the politics is being built on it. The key problem of this story is that the security policy in this region has worsened,

Enough enough, everyone wants a piece of Croatia. Centuries and centures, its was turks, Austro, Hungry, italy, serbia, trying to take. Why can't we be satified what we have. These coutries are greedy, that is why Serbia wanted to take what was not theres in 1992, they rather destroy then let go. We lost Trieste to Italy. If we don't smarten up we will have another civil war.

Woah, woah, woah! What's with all the hate? I hope you guys are still talking about politicians. If so, I agree with you that Slovenian POLITICANS are REALLY BIG (,corrupt) ass holes. The people? Just like any nation! Of course each has their own characteristics. And we, the everyday Slovenian people have NOTHING against Crotia. I respect them very much; as friends and neighbours. I really don't give a damn about immature arguing about the border. Politicians, nationalistic old fishermen and soccer hooligans; they are the only ones who are taking this very seriously. I know that the Slovenian politicians are horrible at representing us, but most politicians don't represent their country in a good light anyway. Berlusconi for Italy? Bush (ex-) for USA? Horrible, horrible people. I really hope you people don't take this shit too seriously. I don't like my country very much, but the hating here is very harsh.

I'm pretty much ashamed to call myself a Slovenian. Fucking retarded politics. Ha! Slovenia. Think they're so big now that they're in the EU. Tiny sized country, with no balls, corruption and stupid redneck people. I am a man living in the 21st century. It's not good, not enjoying it. But I can make the best of it. Just can't wait to move out of this shithole and live elsewhere for the rest of my days. Then I wish to be a bird or something like that in my next life (post-human age). It's a shame I'll always be a lousy Slav(e). Slovenia, get your head out of the clouds and stop being primitive ass holes. Croatians you are being stupid aswell, but I'm on your side.

There are always gonna be problems in this region. Maybe it will be a bit quieter for a few years - I hope so - but eventually those deep-seated animosities will resurface again

Can't wait for both countries to be EU members, then all of this silliness will hopefully not matter anymore!

it funny how all this argueing is going and and yet 90 % of you have no idea what your even talking about.

Hilarious it is reading all these comments below. Anyways, Im currently making a thesis on the croatian/slovenian border dispute with a group of 15 young intellectuals from the University of Mcgill in Montreal. Our analysis on the border dispute is quite shocking as a whole, not only for the region from where the dispute is, but for Europe's existence as well. The bulk of our research is based on international laws,"old" and "new" international disputes and how they were handle and resolved, history of the region, demographics of the region and Economical value if any changes occur. etc...pretty extensive research. With all that said and done, our results certainly doesnt favor Slovenia in any possible way- simply Slovenia by any historical, cultural, demographical even judiciary has no claim and will always be in a non-win position, therefore are using The EU "member clause" to get what they want. I understand the hard feelings and bitterness of the croatian populus refusing such consessions of territory, especially when they had to fight for existence and survival a decade earlier. This dispute could only be resolved by an International body such as the International Courts as they are ment to resolve problems as such with no favoristism. A country "Slovenia" refusing to go to International bodies for assistance in resolving the matter is guilty as charged. Therefore i hope Croatia doesnt cave in under the pressure from its future Union with Europe. If the EU is such a great idea of unity, fraternity and liberty, it is clearly not demonstrating it in this border dispute. Seing EU in Canadian eyes playing the 3 wise monkeys(dont see, hear, smell or taste anything type of deal) is not only a farce, but a lie of The fundametals on what The European Union is built on. Maybee some Europeans instead of arguying on whose right and wrong, should start applying what they preach to candidat countries in its own courts. Therefore this dispute aint anymore a regional dispute, but nevertheless and ethical dispute of the foundation on what the European Union is built on. If The EU is too survive, they have "to lay their fist on the table" start preventing this disease and to cure it once harm has come. The EU is creating(by playing the 3 wise monkeys) a europhobic movement in countries such as candidat states, and even in member countries. Therefore again, the EU is simply setting itself up for failure, as if this goes thru you could only wonder if its gonna stop(other countries playing the member clause to future candidates states). EU the ball is in your court now and i hope you serve an ace.

Here's the Romanian Perspective. Yugoslavia was regarded by us Romanians as the place of freedom, joy, good beaches, and a good prosperous nation. I, like many others, believed that Yugoslavia would surly enter the EU before poor little Romania. But, history did not go that way. Romanians want Croatian and Slovenian brothers to stop arguing over the same goal. Why hasn't Slovenia appealed to Italy for a bigger boarder seeing that they are both in the EU, and croatia is not? It seems that Slovenia is using its political influence to punish Croatia and that IS WRONG! Be nice! Get along!

Jiri: as you can see, the bonds between ex-YU countries are stronger and stronger every day. Only, it takes time. You see, the ex-YU politicians brain-washed their folks for over fifteen years to be able to divide country, and it isn't so easy to override this.

Well, let me say the cliché, "I have a dream" - let's kick out the motherf..... xenophobes and nationalists (both in SLO and CRO, as well as in SER/BiH/etc.) who just use the pretense of national interests for their own politicking and just abolish the borders between such close folks like Slovenians and Croatians (and Serbs, Bosniaks, Macedonians, etc.): why not having a small Schengen-like regime at the place of the former Yugoslavia, with economíc union, one currency, no customs, reciprocal benefits, etc. etc. The current Balcanisation (proof of the age-old geopolitics / divide et impera, played skillfully by foreigners). I am more than positive that the big majority of normal folks in Slovenia, Croatia, Serbia, Macedonis, Montenegro, Albania/Kosovo i Metohija, Bosna i Hercegovina: - would be happy to have unlimited border-free access to the whole former YZ - would be happy to get rid of their funny national currencies and their bysantine converting rates, inflation etc. (just have mutually related exchange rate, like Scottish Pound and British Pound, or like EUR in Eurozone) - would prefer unity in cultural, social, employment, education etc. areas - would prefer joining the EU simultaneously, on good conditions (not jockeying for the position... - competing for the earliest access to the EU is the greatest mistake for all ex-YU citizens, only corrupt, selfish power-hungry politicians prefer the current situation. Where is solidarity and sense of common interest? Petar, Jovan, Jan, Georgi etc. from all parts of ex-EU do not give a damn about this politicking, who's gonna be first in Brussels, who's gonna get first well-paid officials there, whose language will be the official, etc. etc. Get real, kick out all nationalists and join forces (again, I cannot imagine Finns and Swedes racing who's gonna be first in the EU, or Belgians fighting Dutch and Luxembourgians for silly border areas etc.). All things considered, folks, your top politicians show that they do not represent you but their selfish interests and foreign lobbies. Get real and kick them out!!!

I love all Yugoslavian folks (be that Slovenians, Serbs, Croats, Macedonians, Gypsies, Hungarians, Czechs and Slovaks, Albanians, Bosnians, Montenegrins etc. etc.), in fact, I spent a nightmarish decades in the totalitarian state of Czechoslovakia, and Yugoslavia was considered a happy, democratic, strong, positive and free nation: mixing best of both worlds (and I, like many fellow countrymen, used Yugoslavian way to defect to the West). Now, all things considered, especially the huge size of the Croatian land and namely of immense size of Croatian coast, why on earth are Croatian authorities not just a little bit generous and give poor Slovenian brothers just few kilometers of the coast, just like that! Slovenes have so little coastline (Serbs and other folks have none at all), so what is the fuss about little land! And border question is another bulls...! Croatia is to joing the EU, and, naturally, Schengen area, too, and the borders will become invisible, non-existent! Why on earth Slovenes and Croats do not follow example of Norway and Sweden, who have also similar history, culture and language, and to have free customs-free and border-free regime was the issue without asking! Similarly, Slovenia and Croatia (not unlike Czechia and Slovakia) should have no borders, no customs, and no obstacles for people moving back and forth etc. Howgh.

Slovenia as being the only member of the EU needs to start thinking more European. This border dispute is childish and embarrasing. Instead of looking to integration the whole region into European institutions, Slovenia is playing the Old Europe game. We are the only ones priveledged enough to enter this union and maybe has old European partnerships in mind. Slovenia. Hello it's 2009!! And democracy has come.

How do you call a country that refutes the authority of the International Law? Primitive? Could do. Wonder why Slovenes have to be dragged to Hague, kicking and screaming? Perhaps it’s because their claims are as unsubstantiated as it gets. Have to say: personally, I’m utterly amused by their spineless/corrupt politics. Why talk facts, why face to face when you can backstab. Well done Slovenia. Guess it befits you..

A comprehensive legal analysis of the border issue, including few deailed maps can be found at http://slo-pretensions.blogspot.com/2009/03/future-of-eu.html

"At least the serbs were open about their pretensions, however misguided they were, but slovenians lie in wait until they were in the EU to start fabricating their "history". Bunch of spineless pricks. " Hello pot, meet kettle. A Croatian calling Slovenians "spineless pricks?" At least I've had my morning laugh for the day - thanks!

Could we, please, talk about girls and beer?

Pannonius: I don't have a problem with you being an idealist - I just have issue with you writing a very long article to say that we are all basically the same in the "balkans" because we are "nationalist", and only the innocent are always hurt etc.. This is such an old naive story, perpetuated (mainly by the british and the french) by myths and half-truths, which sadly we ourselves choose to believe, rather than argue against. Loving my country makes me a "nationalist", but if I was american, australian, canadian, french, british etc I would be a "prud patriot" and somehow more "civilised" etc.. I deeply resent, and find offensive any insinuations that I am (according to you) a "nationalist". What does that mean anyway? More importantly, what does that make you!? Wherever you're from (not Serbian.?.) you might accept that it's ok for large powers (or small nobodys like slovenia hiding behind large powers)to have their own national agendas which include obvious stealing of land for their own national interest but for me to say "that's stealing, and that is NOT ok", makes ME dangerous and "nationalist" in your eyes??!! The most dangerous people are idealists like you, and no offense but wherever you;re from, is stealing ok?? Large powers are nothing but bullies who use their economic and military might to achieve their social, political and economic agendas at the expense of smaller nations like mine (croatia), and the slovenes are just little dicks hiding behind these big bullies to steal (curiously not from Italy or Austria) from Croatia.. So you can call me whatever you like, but as I said, stealing is still, and always was - stealing, and it's NOT ok. I can not tolerate injustice, and to stand by and watch injustice (because I choose to be an ideologist) would make me as guilty as those who perpetrate evil disguised as "civilisation".. If that makes me a "nationalist" I wonder what it makes you??

Tom: I cannot believe that you do not understand: we, here in Balkans, or, if you like, in Europe, or, wider, all over the world, are in the same sh*t, and if we act like you ("would, pigs, you finally understand that we XX are the best nation on the World"), we will stay in sh*t forever! I don't dream to Croatia become a part of Serbia, contrary, I blamed Milosevic that he did not leaded Serbia out of former Yugoslavia before Slovenians and Croatians, and all others did! And, if the Serbian leadership in the late 80-es would go that way, Croatia would not have to buy those weapons, would not be able to wipe out Serbs, HDZ would be such minor party (and SPS, too!!!!), and many, many things would happened on the better way, and we in Serbia will be far away on the road to Europe! And, not to give you a legitimacy to call me a Martian (Serbian) nationalist (in fact, I am not Serbian at all :))), maybe the whole Region could be much more developed... And there would be no space for nationalist at all..And, you are wrong, I am not supporting Serbian nationalism, I am not happy that they are so loud...And I am not happy that there are nationalist in the Region at all, as Serbian nationalists exist thanks to existence of nationalists in Croatia and vice versa. As you have to admit, my friend Tom, without Serbian, Croatian and Slovenian nationalists, there would be no Croat Slovenian Border Dispute, there will be no forums with themes of confrontation of nationalism ideas, and you would have no theme at all. And, my friend Tom, without Serbian, Croatian and Slovenian nationalism, WE ALL IN THE REGION WOULD BE MUCH HAPPIER!!! My thesis is, that you, my CROATIAN friend Tom, and the other Serbian, Croatian and Slovenian nationalists, are brothers, you need each other to have excuse for doing mess, to keep all the Region in fear, to block the economical, cultural, and any other cooperation of the other normal people. All of the nationalists in the Region, no matter their nationality, are very happy to have their comrades on the other side, and they kept good relationship all the time, as Milosevic and Tudjman did, (and, please, do not bother yourself to prove how smart was Mr. Tudjman, as he fooled Milosevic in the talks how to divided peoples in the Region; his cleverness and stupidness of the other side sent thousands into death. And, the sentence you might say, that Serbs deserved that, will clearly show your radicalism!) All nationalists are, in fact, in the same side, and we, victims, are on the another! And, maybe, there are radical parties only in Serbia and Slovenia, but your words, my Croatian friend Tom, shows how strong is the radicalism in Croatia, too! And, yes, you might say that it is only defence against Serbian and Slovenian enemies, but, isn't Hitler used the same excuse of defence against enemies to make hell for millions in the WW2? We felt this defence in the past many times: nationalists defends themselves upon striking weak people (did you notice that in wars in former Yugoslavia all sides shows they heroism striking the weak and old people; there were very few battles of one army against the other?) But, my Croatian friend Tom, me and my friends have to win the battle with radicals in Serbia, some of the Croats will have to win the battle for democracy against you and guys like you. And, to come back to the theme of the forum, democratic forces in Slovenia will need to win the battle with Mr. Joras! But, my Croatian friend Tom, I afraid that it will take a long, long time!

Pannonius: Of course being from Serbia not only would you immediately take the term "martians" out of its figurative context, but you also at the same time conveniently utilise the logic that Croatia is in fact then on Mars, which would (again) somehow mean that If Serbia are "Martians", then all Croatia, being "on Mars" is in fact also Serbia. That old Serbian dream just won't go away will it?! You manage to turn the figurative into reality yet again. And then you speak of your hope of me and that Slovenian idiot being one day in the past. Typical half-smart Serb. Also, what business you have in Slovenia Croatia disputes anyway, or you just monitoring how much your slovene "friends" learned from Serbs in terms of lie often enough repeated becomes the truth!? As I said, only Serbia and Slovenia have "legitimate" radical right wing parties STILL and -after all - Serbia is in fact ALREADY in the past for Croatia! Good riddance.

Pannonius: Of course being from Serbia not only would you immediately take the term "martians" out of its figurative context, but you also at the same time conveniently utilise the logic that Croatia is in fact then on Mars, which would (again) somehow mean that If Serbia are "Martians", then all Croatia, being "on Mars" is in fact also Serbia. That old Serbian dream just won't go away will it?! You manage to turn the figurative into reality yet again. And then you speak of your hope of me and that Slovenian idiot being one day in the past. Typical half-smart Serb. Also, what business you have in Slovenia Croatia disputes anyway, or you just monitoring how much your slovene "friends" learned from Serbs in terms of lie often enough repeated becomes the truth!? As I said, only Serbia and Slovenia have "legitimate" radical right wing parties STILL and -after all - Serbia is in fact ALREADY in the past for Croatia! Good riddance.

Tom: Mr. Joras and you have much in common. Both of you are romantic nationalists whose ridiculous naivety is used by politicians from late 80's up to now. People like you and Mr. Joras (and plenty of your comrades from Serbia) always do the mess and decades will needs to make new bridges between "Martians" from the neighbourhood. And, let me ask, where do you think you live, if there are Martians everywhere around you (Slovenia, Serbia...) but on Mars itself? My dear Martian friend Tom, all those paramilitary and parapolitical guys have the same text as you, just terms "Serbs, Serbian, Serbia" are swapped by terms "Croats, Croatian, Croats"... I hope that you and all of them will one day be our past...

Obviously, here 'politics' refers to real people with real issues too, as in the case above. I hope that if Mr Joras' house ends up officially in Croatia, that the Croatian authorities make some sort of conciliatory gesture of goodwill. It will all be a part of the EU soon enough anyway.

The way I see it, Slovenia are in the power of power, and will always be slightly more affluent etc than Croatia; it is up to them to make a small sacrifice. Can anyone tell me of any economic reasoning behind the dispute, or is it purely politics?

All this hatred... What good will it do? If you know the whole story you can see that there are no good guys and no bad guys here. Both sides made serious mistakes in the past. Politics used the dispute to gain political points and the result is the unsolvable situation and hatred all around. And what good will it do to anybody...?

Yeah, we have corruption in Croatia. Lucky for us that Italy, Bulgaria, Romania, Greece, Spain and such are already in the EU and they are squeaky clean!? Slovenia has a convicted football hooligan as a registered legitimate politician, and a right-wing one at that but no never mind at your status and view of acceptable civilisation? You are a bunch of wankers (all fourteen of you). Enjoy the power trip while it lasts because it never does, especially for little twerps like you.

Matija: your view of yourself is one that you should worry about the most. As the Serbs learned with their "views" of croatia, there is a lesson for slovenians: You are currently drunk on the little bit of 'power' you have because you are already in the farce that is EU. Surely all four of you in Slovenia are even surprised beyond your wildest imagination that a) you have a say in something at all, b) that someone in the EU knows you are not actually Slovakia and c) believe that people outside slovenia have a better opinion of you than of Croatia. Enjoy this while it lasts, becaus it never does. In your case, this is probably the only time in your miserable little existence that you will get to feel any power whatsoever. Such childish diplomacy which you feel translates into (very limited and short-term) "power" shows your complexes as a (tiny) nation. What a bunch of jokers you are. By the way, how is slovenias treatment of minorities rated in the EU??! Slovenia and Serbia are the only two countries in the region with legitimate radical political parties. We will see you in the EU one way or another, but we are still going to be your (big) neighbour, so you should play nice. While you are on your miserable little powertrip, why don;t you ask for your old capital city (klagenfurt) back from the austrians?? I am sure they will shake in their boots at Slovenia's (or is it Slovakia??) tough talk. You miserable twerps. What goes around comes around, and you should make sure your testicles are not bigger than your brains. See you at Savudrija this summer.

Croatians, you have one of the highest corruption rate in Europe. I don't know what your press is telling you, but from what I can see, your view at this problem is subjective. Your people are not giving you the real truth. I see you are not only hateful towards slovenians but also to serbs and other nations around you. You're lavish in insulting us and other people. You think your point of view is the only right one.... No offense, but overall I get a feeling that you have a different picture of croatia than the rest of the world. This ismply will not work. Take care.

Croatians, you have one of the highest corruption rate in Europe. I don't know what your press is telling you, but from what I can see, your view at this problem is subjective. Your people are not giving you the real truth. I see you are not only hateful towards slovenians but also to serbs and other nations around you. You're lavish in insulting us and other people. You think your point of view is the only right one.... No offense, but overall I get a feeling that you have a different picture of croatia than the rest of the world. This ismply will not work. Take care.

Well,if the problem is so "niggling", "petty" and otherwise just a minor annoyance, why threatenng Croatia with the veto? I'm writing this at the time when the political machinery in in full throttle and anymosities between Slovenia and Croatia high. Looking at this article, written before the current situation was even imaginable, one might conclude that the Slovenes have been planning on blocking Croatia's EU accession all along. Very much in the European spirit of good neighbor ralations and peaceful coexistence. ( read : irony)

Pannonius: We know that according to the Serbs, yes, even the Martians are in fact - Serbs! So, from here on we can refer to Serbs as Martians. The physical and threfore financial toll on Croatia as meted out by serbian military (and paramilitary armed and supported by serbia) obviously cost a hell of a lot of money, (or did you skip school when they taught that economics class?). To now insinuate that the serbs should not be blamed for croatia's costs, and more specifically-losses,is as ludicrous as the slovenes stating that Croatia "stole" their land at the same time as Croatia was under constant bombarding and barrage on croatia by the martians-who are of course actually serbian! I think you travelled plenty and learned nothing. Plus, you might actually be a nice guy, but serb politicians (and the masses who supported them) were in fact - pigs - who now want eveyone to be called "balkan" as its easier to then confuse foreigners with who the real pigs are. As for fascists, the only states in the "Balkans" who still have radical political (nationalist) parties are - you guessed it - Serbia and Slovenia! But because slovenia is not actually considered "balkans" they must be ok though?! At least the serbs were open about their pretensions, however misguided they were, but slovenians lie in wait until they were in the EU to start fabricating their "history". Bunch of spineless pricks.

Pannonius: We know that according to the Serbs, yes, even the Martians are in fact - Serbs! So, from here on we can refer to Serbs as Martians. The physical and threfore financial toll on Croatia as meted out by serbian military (and paramilitary armed and supported by serbia) obviously cost a hell of a lot of money, (or did you skip school when they taught that economics class?). To now insinuate that the serbs should not be blamed for croatia's costs, and more specifically-losses,is as ludicrous as the slovenes stating that Croatia "stole" their land at the same time as Croatia was under constant bombarding and barrage on croatia by the martians-who are of course actually serbian! I think you travelled plenty and learned nothing. Plus, you might actually be a nice guy, but serb politicians (and the masses who supported them) were in fact - pigs - who now want eveyone to be called "balkan" as its easier to then confuse foreigners with who the real pigs are. As for fascists, the only states in the "Balkans" who still have radical political (nationalist) parties are - you guessed it - Serbia and Slovenia! But because slovenia is not actually considered "balkans" they must be ok though?! At least the serbs were open about their pretensions, however misguided they were, but slovenians lie in wait until they were in the EU to start fabricating their "history". Bunch of spineless pricks.

Oh, yeah, Serbs are guilty again, for the Slovenian-Croatian dispute... For Croatians, everyone is a pig except Croatian... shame on you... Croatians blamed Serbs for the bad economy.. Now, they have their own economy, and they doubled their debt in comparison with the whole Ex-Yugoslav debt in 1991! Who is now guilty? SERBS? SLOVENIANS? EU? MARTIANS? Yes, all of them, but Croatians... Yes, there are plenty of problems in drawing border, most of them remains from the Yugoslavian period, but, hey, why we do not seat down as intelligent beings, and solve them making a win-win conditions? No, everybody is a pig, a shit, a... except us, who fucks others etc. etc. And, these people calls themselves civilized people, they want to go to EU!?!?!? I traveled plenty through EX-Yugoslav Republics, and found very kind people everywhere, but found fascistic persons everywhere... And my opinion is that we have to fight with our own fascists, that is the way we could tomorrow seat down and make Balkans a nice place to live with hospitality... This way we just smile to the stranger with fake hospitality, having in mind just to rob their money... what wretches we are!!!!

Response to John Kayfes: valid argument but not so simple: fact is that this is NOT about slovenia access to 'international' waters - they already have this under international maritime law which croatia (and italy) respect. The fact that they have to pay some % to either italy or croatia for using (croatian) sea to access slovenia and (italian) sea to exit is a petty monetary problem. (They don;t mind charging tourists 35 euro to pass through slovenia to croatia at the same time, which - yes - they got in trouble for with the eu, but didn;t really care. Even if slovenia had direct access to international waters close close to croatia border, they would STILL have to go throught croatian territorial sea (or italian) near the island of palagruza (which due to it's proximity to italy "closes" the exit from the adriatic for slovenia yet again, and would therefore be back to square one. So this argument is not really a true reflection of what slovenia is really after. However, near istria, if slovenia is successful in their ridiculous demands, they would be in a position to seek commissions from croatia for the croatian GAS fields and it's numerous (profitable) gas platforms. Another argument I can put forward is that slovenia is an agent for the russians, whose interests are for croatia NOT to be in the eu or nato (as is the serbs' who consider russia their ally, but is not completely true) as nato would then have complete control of access to the mediterranean - remember they allowed albania in nato for this reason (amongst others). Slovenian's are a uniquely strange, selfish and arrogant people, with a "small man" syndrome and complex. Their real beef could be - on the other hand - to ensure that the yanks know the difference between slovakia and slovenia - they are certainly people you must meet for yourself first to understand what I'm talking about. Some would say they are a bunch of inbred fuckwits, but that wouldn;t be suiable for this forum :)

Response to John Kayfes: valid argument but not so simple: fact is that this is NOT about slovenia access to 'international' waters - they already have this under international maritime law which croatia (and italy) respect. The fact that they have to pay some % to either italy or croatia for using (croatian) sea to access slovenia and (italian) sea to exit is a petty monetary problem. (They don;t mind charging tourists 35 euro to pass through slovenia to croatia at the same time, which - yes - they got in trouble for with the eu, but didn;t really care. Even if slovenia had direct access to international waters close close to croatia border, they would STILL have to go throught croatian territorial sea (or italian) near the island of palagruza (which due to it's proximity to italy "closes" the exit from the adriatic for slovenia yet again, and would therefore be back to square one. So this argument is not really a true reflection of what slovenia is really after. However, near istria, if slovenia is successful in their ridiculous demands, they would be in a position to seek commissions from croatia for the croatian GAS fields and it's numerous (profitable) gas platforms. Another argument I can put forward is that slovenia is an agent for the russians, whose interests are for croatia NOT to be in the eu or nato (as is the serbs' who consider russia their ally, but is not completely true) as nato would then have complete control of access to the mediterranean - remember they allowed albania in nato for this reason (amongst others). Slovenian's are a uniquely strange, selfish and arrogant people, with a "small man" syndrome and complex. Their real beef could be - on the other hand - to ensure that the yanks know the difference between slovakia and slovenia - they are certainly people you must meet for yourself first to understand what I'm talking about. Some would say they are a bunch of inbred fuckwits, but that wouldn;t be suiable for this forum :)

Slovenia shouldn't have been granted EU citizenship in the first place. It now shows its true colours, stooping low to become ìthe little brat of Europeî. This guy in the article is so stupid. I bet he could get a nice new house right across the border in Slovenia free of charge, but no doubt he is playing the national pride card. People might not know this but in Slovenia it is a constitutionals crime to put up a flag of another country in any shape or form. If I would try and raise the British flag in Slovenia I'd be either fined or taken to jail. So, why is he so special? Itís a charade of national pride, or more like lack thereof. While you sit there and hold up Croatia's entrance to the EU, maybe you should also think about upholding EU law in your own land. You have a fantastic looking country but your government backs highway robbery on all us tourist to your country by your current Vignette costs (min 35 euro vignette availably only or 800 euro fine). Your highway police are also corrupt. The EU fined your country over this matter. Your governmentís response was to accept the fine with open arms, while saying itís more profitable to pay the fine and make huge profit from the 35 euro vignette. No matter what, one day Croatia will join the EU, and sadly Slovenia will reap what they sow.

Mr.Joras is playing a sore loser for being on the wrong side of the river. The land is Croatian. The Adriatic sea should be Slovenia's sole complaint by which they should be given water territorial access to the Adriatic Sea without being charged with entering Croatian waters. This way no Croat land would be lost and with the vast Adriatic territory that Croatia has she would not be seriously hurt by the territorial waters rectification. Isn't the sea access the real debate in this border dispute. If not Slovenia is asking for to much -Croatia's land.

This article makes Joras look like a fool - which is not fair. What would you do if you bought a house in a country next to the border, but then the other country moved the border some 100 metres and claimed your house? Would you not resist too? When Joras bought his house many years ago in Yugoslavia, the road sign "Croatia" was positioned some 300 metres down the road into Croatia. All authorities treated the location of his house as Slovenian: Slovenian electricity company, Slovenian housing authority, Slovenian identity card, location registered for voting in Slovenia, and so on. And then comes Slovenian and Croatian independence, and Croatia pushes the border some 300 metres all the way to the river. Croatia stated numerous times that this is only "temporary" (Croatian prime minister stated so explicitly in 1994). But in fact, Croatia never moved back to the border of 1991 - and it clearly has no intention of doing so in the future either. And then Joras is painted as a comical fool for resisting!

That's a typical serbian apologist stupid comment about Croats and Tudjman's "fascist state..". First of all, it was never "Tudjmans", but of Croatians, for the Croatians (and anyone civilised enough to respect it whilst living in it). Secondly, many of Tudjman's family were killed by the nazis in WW2, and he was a partizan and a highly decorated Yugoslav People's Army General and a Croatian Socialist, so please don't write un-informed and stupid opinions as opposed to facts. As for the "haague", Croatia should have never allowed itself to be placed in the same basket as the agressor (Serbs) in the first place. Haague is a farce, and everyone knows that. Approportioning blame equally to Croatia (for defending itself) is an act without precedent. The Haague merely underlines the EU's unwillingness and inability to do anything about Serbian agression in the 90's (on Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia & Kosovo) in the first place! The haague is about cleansing Europe's stained soul - if it ever had any in the first place - and trying to convince itself that it has some "testicular density" after all. You my friend, on the other hand, are just an idiot, just like the current Slovenian government.

Geez, you emigree Croats all still seem to be living in Tudjman's fascist state that "couldn't" arrest its war criminals until a couple of years ago. And you just can't stop spewing the hatred and xenophobia that spawned that regime ... Get a grip on reality: if Croatia had complied with the ICTY's request on time it would have been a great deal further along its path to EU membership. Instead Croatia self-centeredly blames its problems on anyone but itself - first it was the Hague court's fault, now it's Slovenian, what next ...?

This maritime border dispute where slovenia is creating so much fuss to aquire international access to the adratic is stiffed necked on behalf of Slovenia. The Slovene government can make the same demand from Italy to gain international. access from the western side of the adratic ( gulf of veneto). Do you see Croatia making the same demands on Serbia for the return of Srijem!

he he he.. Also, seeing there are no "borders" in the EU, Slovenia should give access to Hungary, Austria and Italy to its port and a beach. Oh yeah, I forgot, not enough room :) Why can't slovenian fishing boats go through Italian waters, seeing there arfe no "borders"? What's the real problem for SLovenia here?? Slovenia should enjoy it's moment of petty self-gratifying feeling of being important, and look to next hundred years and what happens when Croatia is admitted to the EU as it will happen, whether in the next year or ten years and ask itself - what then? Slovenia is the one not being tactful here, and is plainly abusing its position in the EU to play silly political games. It' what happens when a small insecure place with an identity crisis has a veto in the EU. Croatia really didn't expect such a back-stab from what we thought were friendly neighbours. Good luck Slovenia, all the best in the future relations with anyone, you back-stabbing little shits. You're a petrol station and a rest-stop on the way to Croatia, nothing more, get over it.

We're not primitive - just our Slovenian neighbours are sneaky thiefs when they pretend to be civilised because they are in the EU. (Why is Switzerland not in the EU??) Why Slovenia had no "issues" when itself entered the farce that is EU, but figured that, as an EU member it will be ok to fabricate 'fact' (like the Serbs did) and abuse its position as an EU member to now realise that apparently Croatia in 1991 "invaded" Slovenan lands?? Where the hell is this information coming from?? What a Slovenian farce. If Slovenes want access to international waters (without going through the Croatian Exclusive Economic zone) - ask Italians to give Trieste to Slovenia, seeing that there are no 'borders' in the EU and seeing that apparently Slovenia was at some point bigger than China??! Small country with small dicks given veto power in the EU. Shows what a farce the EU is as a whole. I would like to see what would happen if a Slovenian 'farmer' set up camp on Swiss border and fly Slovenian flag on it, and grafitti "this is Slovenia". Merry Christmas everybody.

How primitive ! What about France that gave as gift a nice peace of land to the Swiss Confederation so that Geneva Canton can unite with the rest of the Switzerland ?! Why is a piece of land or sea so important when there are no borders in the EU ? Why is it so difficult to live with each other in peace ? Primitivism, lack of intelligence... Power hunger...

Oh eat shit all of you, you were only given that part of the coast becuase of tito. you went for the landgrab. it was all croatian until people like you serbs and the italians with trst started chewing away at croatia.. and istra slovenian? are you fucking kidding me. thats what you guys and the serbs are trying to do, with the branch connecting istra and slavonia being so thin. Leave us alone. Stop being the greedy slovenian pigs you all know you are. Just jealousy and greed, is all you guys have. Land grab, it doesnt matter if its 2m or 2ookm, you dont give away what is yours. Croatians have been through so much crap, they deserve the utmost respect. You pigs... upson crosing the border from and through slovenia a sign read "please do not feed the pigs" haha, aka please do not feed the Slovenians. hahah picke

Croatia should give all Istria to Slovenia because Croatia is not worth to have it!

Slovenia now a part of the EU gang, is not the only country, EU's land grab crime is lower then we as a free people can prosses. Namely territory over which Croatia has more than 15,000 Croats were murdered 4000 are still missing 220,000 displaced. Croatia's borders are Europe's oldest and so-called undivided Adriatic Sea. The sea is not and cannot be the subject of succession sea belongs to the land and depends on the land which is Croatia. Austria must have sea access to sea. What is sad about all this Slovenia disallows Austria access to sea. You Slovenians may open a Pandora’s box.